Doggie Day Care Question (actually behavior question)

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Doggie Day Care Question (actually behavior question)

Post by Dave Fluke » Fri, 28 Jan 2000 04:00:00



Hi all -

I am a little concerned about my dog's behavior as of late.

We both work full time.  We live in a townhouse with no yard and so our dog,
Morgan (lab/boxer/chow mix), spent most of her first year with us staying at
home by herself during the day.  I come home at lunch to walk her.

Lately we've been a little concerned about her being alone most of the day -
thinking she seemed bored and kind of depressed and all.  So we decided last
week to take her on Mon/Wed/Fri to a pet sitter in our area.  There is a lot
of land to run on and other dogs to play with so we thought she would really
enjoy spending her day outdoors and socializing with other dogs.

We just started this week (monday & wednesday) and I have noticed a couple
of things I am concerned about:

1.  When I pick her up at the sitter's, she is at the door immediately for
me to take her home.  I mean she is really ready to go home.  No BS - "let's
go home daddy...right NOW"
2.   She is exeptionally tired once we get home and sleeps most of the
evening and night away (this I attribute to lengthy play time which she is
not used to).

But my real concern is:

3.  When we take her out there (or this morning when she was going to stay
home) she gets really nervous and shakes like she is terrified of having to
go to the pet sitter's house.  I have never seen her act this way.  She was
sitting upstairs this morning after my shower and literally shaking from
nervousness.  And was very relieved that she got to stay home today.

Once she get's there (on the days we take her) and sees the other dogs, she
seems to be fine with it, but in the car she acts nervous and shaky as well.

My question is really this:

Is this a normal behavior for a dog in her situation (i.e., will she get
used to it and eventually calm down and enjoy it)?
Also, should we be at all concerned about how she may be getting treated
there?  I like the pet sitter, she is very dog-oriented, runs an ***
animal and dog rescue and seems to be very good with Morgan.  She reports to
me that Morgan seems to always have a good time there.  I don't believe that
she is in any way being mistreated there.

I could really use some input on this from you folks out there.

--
Dave Fluker

 
 
 

Doggie Day Care Question (actually behavior question)

Post by Jerry How » Fri, 28 Jan 2000 04:00:00



Quote:
> Hi all -

> I am a little concerned about my dog's behavior as of late.

> We both work full time.  We live in a townhouse with no yard and so
our dog,
> Morgan (lab/boxer/chow mix), spent most of her first year with us
staying at
> home by herself during the day.  I come home at lunch to walk her.

> Lately we've been a little concerned about her being alone most of
the day -
> thinking she seemed bored and kind of depressed and all.  So we
decided last
> week to take her on Mon/Wed/Fri to a pet sitter in our area.  There
is a lot
> of land to run on and other dogs to play with so we thought she
would really
> enjoy spending her day outdoors and socializing with other dogs.

> We just started this week (monday & wednesday) and I have noticed a
couple
> of things I am concerned about:

> 1.  When I pick her up at the sitter's, she is at the door
immediately for
> me to take her home.  I mean she is really ready to go home.  No
BS - "let's
> go home daddy...right NOW"
> 2.   She is exeptionally tired once we get home and sleeps most of
the
> evening and night away (this I attribute to lengthy play time which
she is
> not used to).

> But my real concern is:

> 3.  When we take her out there (or this morning when she was going
to stay
> home) she gets really nervous and shakes like she is terrified of
having to
> go to the pet sitter's house.  I have never seen her act this way.
She was
> sitting upstairs this morning after my shower and literally shaking
from
> nervousness.  And was very relieved that she got to stay home
today.

> Once she get's there (on the days we take her) and sees the other
dogs, she
> seems to be fine with it, but in the car she acts nervous and shaky
as well.

> My question is really this:

> Is this a normal behavior for a dog in her situation (i.e., will
she get
> used to it and eventually calm down and enjoy it)?
> Also, should we be at all concerned about how she may be getting
treated
> there?  I like the pet sitter, she is very dog-oriented, runs an
***
> animal and dog rescue and seems to be very good with Morgan.  She
reports to
> me that Morgan seems to always have a good time there.  I don't
believe that
> she is in any way being mistreated there.

> I could really use some input on this from you folks out there.

> --
> Dave Fluker

Hello Dave,

What you describe is pretty much what I would consider normal
behavior. The cause however, could be happy e***ment and eager
anticipation, or based on genuine fear and terror... It's hard to
tell whether she is happy and exuberant and e***d about going, or
terrified to death of being mishandled... The same body language
seems to apply to both ends of the spectrum...

Similarly, when you see people that have seemingly happy working dogs
that have been trained with shock collars and abusive force training,
their "trainers" will show you Howe happy and e***d their dogs seem
to work... What you will see when you watch them, is TERROR, NOT
pleasure in their work... But people are constantly duped by the
frantik fraud die's and the cindy moore's and amy dahls, that will
terrorize dogs, and tell you that the proof is in the happy tail
wagging and e***d attitude they demonstrate when they are
working... IT IS IMPOSSIBLE FOR AN UNTRAINED EYE TO DETERMINE THE
DIFFERENCE!

So, use close scrutiney, good judgement, common sense, and never
believe what the professionals tell you when your own observations
and good judgement tell you otherwise...

Most people that work with animals are decent, caring, loving
individuals that would never do anything inappropriate... However,
just look at the caliber of abusive people here, OUR R.P.D.B.
Regulars, that will tell you to shock, choke, jerk, punish, confront,
twist ears and toes, and hang your dog, to enhance the bond between
trainer and dog, and to achieve the higher aspects of obedience...

BE AFRAID, BE VERY AFRAID... The inmates are running the asylum!

;~) DRAINING THE SWAMP, AND RELOCATING THE GATORS... J>>>

"CUSTOM WILL RECONCILE PEOPLE TO ANY ATROCITY." G.B. Shaw.

"I know that most men, including those at ease with problems
of the greatest complexity, can seldom accept even the
simplest and most obvious truth if it would oblige them to
admit the falsity of conclusions which they have delighted in
explaining to colleagues, proudly taught to others, and which
they have woven, thread by thread, into the fabric of their
lives."
                                             Leo Tolstoy

Is it any wonder that the following sig file has generated more
complaints to my personal email than any other controversial
post I have made to date, bar none?:

                                            caveat
If you have to do things to your dog to train him, that you would
rather not have to do, then you shouldn't be doing them. If you
have a dog trainer that tells you to jerk your dog around, ***
him, pinch his ears, or twist his toes, shock, shake, slap, scold,
hit, or punish him in any manner, that corrections are
appropriate, that the dog won't think of you as the punisher,
or that corrections are not harmful, or if they can't train your
dog to do what you want, look for a trainer that knows Howe.

Sincerely,
Jerry Howe,
Wits' End Dog Training

http://www.moonsgarden.com/
Nature, to be mastered, must be obeyed.
                      -Francis Bacon-

There are terrible people who, instead of solving a problem,
bungle it and make it more difficult for all who come after.  Who
ever can't hit the nail on the head should, please, not hit at all.
                     -Nietzsche-

The abilities to think, rationalize and solve problems are learned
qualities.

The Wits' End Dog Training Method challenges the learning
centers in the dogs brain. These centers, once challenged,
develop and continue to grow exponentially, to make him smarter.

The Wits' End Dog Training method capitalizes on praising split
seconds of canine thought, strategy, and timing, not mindless
hours of forced repetition, constant corrections, and scolding.
                  -Jerry Howe-

 
 
 

Doggie Day Care Question (actually behavior question)

Post by cind » Fri, 28 Jan 2000 04:00:00


If you have a camcorder take it with you on a day when Morgan will be with
the sitter and ask her to video Morgan at play with the other dogs, etc. She
may or may not have the time to do this if she has alot of dogs on a given
day. Request that you set up a time(maybe at your lunch hour) where you can
come and observe Morgan without her(morgan...not the sitter) knowing that
you are there.
Have you extended the courtesy of informing the sitter of Morgan's shaking,
etc.? Perhaps there is an explaination. Could it be that she is reacting in
a positive fashion...as in delighted to go, rather than the way you have
assumed she is reacting negatively?  Do you take some of her own things with
so she has familiar things with her? Has the sitter suggested that you bring
a small quilt or blanket for rest time for her to have a familiar scent to
make her more comfy?
Could it be that Morgan is just extremely happy to see you after a day of
playing with new friends and dealing with new situations?  These are just a
few of the things I would do and or think about in your position.  Hope you
can get it figured out.  I believe every species needs to have at least one
friend of their same kind.  Cindy

--
adopt one or two from your local shelter

Quote:
> Hi all -

> I am a little concerned about my dog's behavior as of late.

> We both work full time.  We live in a townhouse with no yard and so our
dog,
> Morgan (lab/boxer/chow mix), spent most of her first year with us staying
at
> home by herself during the day.  I come home at lunch to walk her.

> Lately we've been a little concerned about her being alone most of the
day -
> thinking she seemed bored and kind of depressed and all.  So we decided
last
> week to take her on Mon/Wed/Fri to a pet sitter in our area.  There is a
lot
> of land to run on and other dogs to play with so we thought she would
really
> enjoy spending her day outdoors and socializing with other dogs.

> We just started this week (monday & wednesday) and I have noticed a couple
> of things I am concerned about:

> 1.  When I pick her up at the sitter's, she is at the door immediately for
> me to take her home.  I mean she is really ready to go home.  No BS -
"let's
> go home daddy...right NOW"
> 2.   She is exeptionally tired once we get home and sleeps most of the
> evening and night away (this I attribute to lengthy play time which she is
> not used to).

> But my real concern is:

> 3.  When we take her out there (or this morning when she was going to stay
> home) she gets really nervous and shakes like she is terrified of having
to
> go to the pet sitter's house.  I have never seen her act this way.  She
was
> sitting upstairs this morning after my shower and literally shaking from
> nervousness.  And was very relieved that she got to stay home today.

> Once she get's there (on the days we take her) and sees the other dogs,
she
> seems to be fine with it, but in the car she acts nervous and shaky as
well.

> My question is really this:

> Is this a normal behavior for a dog in her situation (i.e., will she get
> used to it and eventually calm down and enjoy it)?
> Also, should we be at all concerned about how she may be getting treated
> there?  I like the pet sitter, she is very dog-oriented, runs an ***
> animal and dog rescue and seems to be very good with Morgan.  She reports
to
> me that Morgan seems to always have a good time there.  I don't believe
that
> she is in any way being mistreated there.

> I could really use some input on this from you folks out there.

> --
> Dave Fluker

 
 
 

Doggie Day Care Question (actually behavior question)

Post by R&D Rya » Fri, 28 Jan 2000 04:00:00


Are you sure the shaking is a "bad" nervous thing? My BC cross shakes
like a leaf when he is e***d. The body language is slightly different
and hard to notice but I can read him now and have gotten to know the
difference.
 
 
 

Doggie Day Care Question (actually behavior question)

Post by Toni » Fri, 28 Jan 2000 04:00:00



Quote:
> Are you sure the shaking is a "bad" nervous thing? My BC cross shakes
> like a leaf when he is e***d. The body language is slightly different
> and hard to notice but I can read him now and have gotten to know the
> difference.

True......
dogs that come in for grooming often 'shake'.
It is e***ment, plus a tad of anxiousness.
The best thing you can do is ignore it........the worst, try to "poor baby"
it away.

--
Toni
www.irish-wolfhounds.com
Check the "Update on Steve"

 
 
 

Doggie Day Care Question (actually behavior question)

Post by Fshndgs4 » Sat, 29 Jan 2000 04:00:00


When you come to pick her up from the pet sitter,  your dog should be
absolutely thrilled to see you and want to go home with you...that is natural.

But there may be the chance that your dog might be suffering from separation
anxiety and she may be spending the whole day wondering why you deserted her.
That would also make for a worn out dog that evening after coming home and
would account for the nervousness when going to the pet sitters.  You need to
have a serious talk with your pet sitter and see what she thinks is going on.
Most dogs do get much better about being left if you don't make too big of a
deal over them when you leave them...treat the whole business of leaving them
at the pet sitters without a big show of emotion.  It should get better over
time.

Quote:
> So we decided last
>week to take her on Mon/Wed/Fri to a pet sitter in our area.  There is a
>lot
>of land to run on and other dogs to play with so we thought she would really
>enjoy spending her day outdoors and socializing with other dogs.

>We just started this week (monday & wednesday) and I have noticed a couple
>of things I am concerned about:

>1.  When I pick her up at the sitter's, she is at the door immediately for
>me to take her home.  I mean she is really ready to go home.  No BS - "let's
>go home daddy...right NOW"
>2.   She is exeptionally tired once we get home and sleeps most of the
>evening and night away (this I attribute to lengthy play time which she
>is
>not used to).

>But my real concern is:

>3.  When we take her out there (or this morning when she was going to stay
>home) she gets really nervous and shakes like she is terrified of having
>to
>go to the pet sitter's house.  I have never seen her act this way.  She
>was
>sitting upstairs this morning after my shower and literally shaking from
>nervousness.  And was very relieved that she got to stay home today.

>Once she get's there (on the days we take her) and sees the other dogs,
>she
>seems to be fine with it, but in the car she acts nervous and shaky as well.

>My question is really this:

>Is this a normal behavior for a dog in her situation (i.e., will she get
>used to it and eventually calm down and enjoy it)?
>Also, should we be at all concerned about how she may be getting treated
>there?  I like the pet sitter, she is very dog-oriented, runs an ***
>animal and dog rescue and seems to be very good with Morgan.  She reports
>to
>me that Morgan seems to always have a good time there.  I don't believe
>that
>she is in any way being mistreated there.

 
 
 

Doggie Day Care Question (actually behavior question)

Post by Dave Fluke » Sat, 29 Jan 2000 04:00:00


Hi again all!

Many thanks for all of your kind responses.  I found your advice very
helpful.

I would say that my wife and I are not yet so tuned into Morgan that we know
the difference between nervous shake and e***d/anxious shake.  Hopefully
we will eventually learn the subtle differences.

On a positive note, I took her to the sitter this morning and while she was
just a tad shaky in the car, she was actually happy to get there (once she
knew where she was going) and ran right out to play with her friends.  I did
bring her favorite towel for her to lay on and some of her personal treats
for the sitter to give her (in case she just misses home).

I did speak with the sitter and she said something very similar...that it
may be e***ment and not fear.  She explained very clearly how Morgan
spends her day and everything that goes on.  I do have confidence in this
sitter because of her reputation around town as "the" sitter of choice, her
disposition and love of animals, and the fact that she runs an animal
rescue.  She also recommmended I speak to the vet about it if we are really
concerned.  She also said that if we do feel that Morgan doesn't like to
come, we shouldn't bring her.  However, it appears this morning that Morgan
is just fine and is now "getting into the routine".  She told me Morgan
seems to have the time of her life playing with the other dogs.

One really positive thing we have noticed even after only 2 days (today
being the third) is that Morgan's dog-to-dog social skills are MUCH better
than they were.  Others we know with dogs have commented as well.

I think maybe it was a new experience for all of us and we didn't know what
we were seeing.  I think she is getting used to going (reducing seperation
anxiety) and will soon be looking forward to her days at the sitter's.

Again, thanks to those who were helpful with advice and insight
(Fshngdgs428, Toni, R&D Ryan, Jerry Howe and Cindy).

Dave

 
 
 

Doggie Day Care Question (actually behavior question)

Post by Jerry How » Mon, 31 Jan 2000 04:00:00



Quote:



> > Are you sure the shaking is a "bad" nervous thing? My BC cross
shakes
> > like a leaf when he is e***d. The body language is slightly
different
> > and hard to notice but I can read him now and have gotten to know
the
> > difference.

> True......
> dogs that come in for grooming often 'shake'.
> It is e***ment, plus a tad of anxiousness.
> The best thing you can do is ignore it........the worst, try to
"poor baby"
> it away.
> Toni
> www.irish-wolfhounds.com
> Check the "Update on Steve"

Sure,... And you wouldn't want to decondition or train the behavior
away, it's easy to do. But you gotta know Howe... J>>>

*** is the last refuge of the incompetent. Salvor Hardin

If you cannot convince them, confuse them. H.F. Truman.

;~) DRAINING THE SWAMP, AND RELOCATING THE GATORS... J>>>

"CUSTOM WILL RECONCILE PEOPLE TO ANY ATROCITY." G.B. Shaw.

"I know that most men, including those at ease with problems
of the greatest complexity, can seldom accept even the
simplest and most obvious truth if it would oblige them to
admit the falsity of conclusions which they have delighted in
explaining to colleagues, proudly taught to others, and which
they have woven, thread by thread, into the fabric of their
lives."
                                             Leo Tolstoy

Is it any wonder that the following sig file has generated more
complaints to my personal email than any other controversial
post I have made to date, bar none?:

                                            caveat
If you have to do things to your dog to train him, that you would
rather not have to do, then you shouldn't be doing them. If you
have a dog trainer that tells you to jerk your dog around, ***
him, pinch his ears, or twist his toes, shock, shake, slap, scold,
hit, or punish him in any manner, that corrections are
appropriate, that the dog won't think of you as the punisher,
or that corrections are not harmful, or if they can't train your
dog to do what you want, look for a trainer that knows Howe.

Sincerely,
Jerry Howe,
Wits' End Dog Training

http://www.moonsgarden.com/
Nature, to be mastered, must be obeyed.
                      -Francis Bacon-

There are terrible people who, instead of solving a problem,
bungle it and make it more difficult for all who come after.  Who
ever can't hit the nail on the head should, please, not hit at all.
                     -Nietzsche-

The abilities to think, rationalize and solve problems are learned
qualities.

The Wits' End Dog Training Method challenges the learning
centers in the dogs brain. These centers, once challenged,
develop and continue to grow exponentially, to make him smarter.

The Wits' End Dog Training method capitalizes on praising split
seconds of canine thought, strategy, and timing, not mindless
hours of forced repetition, constant corrections, and scolding.
                  -Jerry Howe-

 
 
 

Doggie Day Care Question (actually behavior question)

Post by Mary Heale » Thu, 10 Feb 2000 04:00:00


Quote:

> 1.  When I pick her up at the sitter's, she is at the door immediately for
> me to take her home.  I mean she is really ready to go home.  No BS - "let's
> go home daddy...right NOW"

There's no place like home.

Quote:
> 2.   She is exeptionally tired once we get home and sleeps most of the
> evening and night away (this I attribute to lengthy play time which she is
> not used to).

That'd be my guess.

Quote:
> But my real concern is:

> 3.  When we take her out there (or this morning when she was going to stay
> home) she gets really nervous and shakes like she is terrified of having to
> go to the pet sitter's house.  I have never seen her act this way.  She was
> sitting upstairs this morning after my shower and literally shaking from
> nervousness.  And was very relieved that she got to stay home today.

Are you sure the shaking is nervousness and not e***ment?  Does she
leave the house willingly?  If it is nervousness, you might ask the care
provider to keep an eye out for bullying behavior in the playgroup - it
can be very subtle and still have a strong effect on some dogs.

M.