Moon's Graden

I'm interested in the "Pit" Bull Terrier breeds (American Safforshire,
American Pit Bull, Saffordshire Bull). However, I have several questions.

First of all, I know they where origionally bred to be dog-aggressive, but
what about this "high prey drive" thing I keep hearing about? Pits where not
hunting dogs... so did they get it from an ancestor (terrier?), or is that a
load of doggie-pooh spread around by unknowing people trying to explane why
the dogs are "viciose"?

Also. It's my understanding that terriers are *** (please correct me if
I'm wrong). Are the Bull Terrier breeds this way? None of the "Pits" I know
are like that.... hmm. Something to ponder on ^_~

I've heard Clicker Training is best for these kinds of dogs... but what
about ***? I don't know much about clicker training, it seems though
that instead of teaching the dog it should listen to you because you are in
charge, it teaches the dog to listen to you because... because... it's
rewarded when it does? Ummm, I'm not totally sure on that. But I am sure
that if I had a big strong dog like a AmStaff or Pit Bull Terrier, I'd feel
a *lot* better knowing the dog respects me as a "higher power". For those of
you who use clicker training and other new training methods, do you think
non-*** acts of *** (ie: not letting the dog on bed, going ahead
of the dog/making the dog sit-sta before giving the dog anything, etc) would
work along with the clicker training?

And although I am not planing to get a dog at the moment (I would love to
eventually own one), something has been bothering me for a while. Is it a
better idea to adopt a "pit" puppy, make sure it's from a reputable breeder
and from a line that's known to be frienfly and non-dog aggressive, do lots
of obediance training, socialization, and hope for the best- OR get an ***
dog who's already known to be dog-friendly? Both have there pros and cons...
~sigh~

Final question. Just because the dog is dog-aggressive, does that mean it's
likely to also be aggressive with other animals?

Thank you for your time!

Renee Reed
PS: Sorry for my poor spelling...

The Terriers used was many different kinds, from different parts of th UK.
Each had their own prey drive. Some where good as pointers, some was good to
catch small animals, and some to catch bigger animals.

All these dogs was mixed with the old bulldoge.
They were mixed to get the ultimat dog, The strenght of the bulldog, and the
speed and "prey-drive" of the terrier.

The reason the dogs have been fought in pits is to get the dog that never
gives up, and mix him with the other dog who never gives up.
This is for most people too much dog. (Pitbull-Performance bred)
But they are really nice dogs!

basically just teach polite manners from the beginning.. and socialize
socialize socialize..   take him everywhere and let him meet as ;many people
as possible..  do it while he's small and cute and everyone is glad to make
friends with the cute little baby..  if the people where you live are like
the people here, they will run in terror when he is older as soon as they
hear the words "pit bull"   but, if your dog is an outstanding good citizen,
he will be an ambassador for his breed and hopefully help to end some of
this hysteria..  if even one person realizes that not all pitbulls are
killers, then both of you have accomplilshed something great..

about the ***..   my Loki is a Australian Shepherd/pit-mix cross...
aka a mutt.. :)  he is the sweetest most over-sized baby in the world..  he
is ALSO pig-headed, stubborn, pushy, and sneaky and way to smart for my own
good..   he invents new ways to get into trouble and if he thinks there is
even a chance of you backing down, he will try to walk all over you..

just my own experience..

dainerra

No, they aren't.

First, their history as fighting
dogs has made them very tolerant
of handling by humans.

As for their behavior with other
dogs, they were bred for gameness
rather than for aggression per se.
The difference is approximately
that between willingness to finish
a fight once one starts vs willingness
to start fights or simply attack.
The breed is actually quite variable
re aggression in the above sense.
It is also variable re gameness,
but the biggest problem people
keep getting into generally is
NOT that their dog is constantly
picking fights and attacking dogs,
but that a dog that has never shown
any aggression before got into a
fight that the owners were helpless
to stop.

In any event, none of this has anything
to do with *** per se.

JohnR
Pit Bull Libertarian

Never sneer at the power of a little
pink squeaky toy!

Your questions are WAY too broad to be answered effectively on an
Internet group like this.  There are some great websites with good basic
information you need to read first.Here's just one you must read:
http://www.nyx.net/~mbur/apbt.html
This is the "FAQ" for the rpd newsgroups like the one you're posting to.
http://www.k9web.com/dog-faqs/

Emily (not ~Emily)

Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

From Martin Weil's, "Bull Terrier":

"One unusual by-product of the sporting origins of the Bull Terrier is that
a dog had to be developed that was not only unusually strong, fast,
thoroughly game, and able to think for itself in an emergency, but which at
the same time, though injured in a match, would not, even in pain, turn on
it's master.  This latter characteristic makes the breed unusually reliable
with children, whose often unmerciful mauling would cause a less friendly
dog to snap.  When the Bull Terrier's patience is tried beyond bounds, his
reaction is to get up and move."

I would guess (certainly in my experience anyway) that much of that applies
to the other Bull-and-Terrier breeds as well.

IMHO anyway,

~Jamaica

Renee Reed

   OK, I know that a pit is one of the least likely dogs to bite a human - but
what about dog-to-dog aggression?   I would like to say outright that I'm in
the "consideration" stage of obtaining a second dog.   Bonnie seems to really
enjoy boxers and pit bulls - they play like she does - lots of "boxing",
wrestling, sparring... most normal dogs are put off by this.
   I am looking very seriously at an Amstaff or pit bull because I want a
medium sized, short coated dog with great athletic ability, intelligence,
stamina, and a dog that is very active but not loopy - ie it won't pace for
hours in the house on the days I'm not outside.  I do a lot of outdoor stuff -
kayaking, hiking, biking, horseback riding, skiing, etc.   Bonnie does it with
me except the horse stuff and skiing (she tends to bumble into the horses'
legs).   Versatility is the key - a dog who can go on therapy visits, do
agility and flyball, obedience, drafting.
    How can I prevent dog-to-dog problems with Bonnie and another dog?  I don't
want her to be constantly dominated and beat up by a dog that is larger,
stronger, and more agile than she is.   I'd definitely be starting out with a
puppy.
   An unrelated question - in most cropped breeds, the ears are done at 2-3
months of age.  When are Amstaffs cropped?  I want a dog with ears!

Jana
 &Bonnie

Lynn K.

belleshine