Fertilizers defined, part I

Description of your first forum.

Fertilizers defined, part I

Post by Scott Dickins » Tue, 10 Feb 1998 04:00:00



Fellow rosarians:

OK, this is the first of a series on this that I will post on
fertilizing roses. Since there are/were many posts asking about
rose fertilizer to use, and if MiricleGro works, etc. I will post
this explanation which will be rather detailed. Opinions vary, as
will your rose blooms...

                Rose Fertilizers Defined, part I

It seems that the stores have lots of types of fertilizers on the
shelves, and they vary greatly in price. So which one do you buy?
Do you buy the Special Rose formula, or the Super Duper Rose
formula? Should you get the green slow release pellets in the box?
Or the blue soluble stuff in the bags? Should you buy the Miricle
Gro[TM] formula or the off brand next to it for less? Should you go
organic or chemical? Or combine both?

OK, first things first. Every bag or bottle of fertilizer
has to have the % breakdown of nitrogen, phosphate and potassium
on the label, and it is always in that order. Regardless of what
the package says it is for, the formula must be on it. The %
breakdown is labeled in a series of numbers, such as 30-10-10, or
10-15-10. 30-10-10 means that it has 30% NITROGEN, 10% PHOSPHOROUS,
and 10% POTASSIUM by volume. This is a high nitrogen fertilizer,
and is the composition of MirAcid[TM] (a Miricle Gro fertilizer that
is popular). 10-15-10 means that it has 10% nitrogen, 15% potassium,
and 10% phosphate. This is the formula for MiricleGro[TM] fertilizer.
Other trace elements such as manganese, chelated iron, sulfur, etc.
are also listed in fine print. These trace elements are also important,
but not as much as nitrogen, phosphate and potassium.

There are all sorts of %-%-% combinations, and I have seen just
about avery combination imaginable claim that it is specially
formulated for roses. I have also seen the same formulas in bottles at
places like Long's *** with the exact same %-%-% labeled for different
plants and priced accordingly! The "general" house plant food was in a
green bottle for $2.29. The same formula in a yellow bottle was labeled
for "flowering plants" for $2.59. And the violet bottle was labeled
for "African Violets & Orchids" and listed for $2.89!!! And they all had
the exact same %-%-% formula! A similar thing happens with brand
marketing, but I will get into that in a future post. The point is that
the numbers on the packages tell you what the fertilizer is, and not the
brand name or what the lable says it is for.

So you might be wondering what to feed your roses then? It really
depends on soil type (acidic or alkaline) and what climate you live
in. Soil Ph creates a problem chemically in soils and what is true
for acidic soil is quite different in alkaline soil. Here's why:
In acidic soils, phosphorous is not as available to plant roots,
and gets locked up in the soil. something like 1% of the phosphorous
in the soil is available to plant roots. So in acid soil regions, you
need to add more phosphorous than you do in alkaline soil regions.
Here in California, the soil is mostly alkaline, and thus phosphorous
is not needed as much. Likewise, in Oregon where the soil is acidic,
phosphorous is needed more. A similar, but opposite problem exists for
iron. In alkaline soils, iron is not available to plants, and thus the
need to add chelated iron here. In acidic soil iron is available, and
thus not really a problem (nor as much needed in feeding).

As for feeding your roses, in San Diego, CA they will require a lot
more nitrogen and heavy feeding than they will in say, Vancouver, BC,
Canada where they will have a shorter growing/blooming period. roses
tend to be heavy feeders, and as someone said in another post to this
newsgroup, they are more like pigs. They will eat anything. This is
quite true, as UC Davis studies show that fertilizers of all types
and origins will be taken up by the plant and used in the same way.
Regradless of how much you paid for it at the store.

So lets review:

All fertilizers have the 3 main components listed on them in the order
of: nitrogen, phosphorous and potassium in % breakdown. Trace elements
are also listed. The elements needed vary depending on the soil type
and Ph that you grow your roses in. Phosphate is needed more in acidic
soils, and (chelated) iron is needed more in alkaline soils. And finally
roses are gluttons, think of them as ravenous pigs.  

More *fertilizer* to come...

Scott
Campbell, CA

 
 
 

Fertilizers defined, part I

Post by lm » Wed, 11 Feb 1998 04:00:00



Quote:
>...think of them as ravenous pigs...  

>More *fertilizer* to come...

you just felt the need, huh?
very well, Scott.  Did you get hit on the head by one of those pineapples?

m

 
 
 

Fertilizers defined, part I

Post by Patrick Burk » Wed, 11 Feb 1998 04:00:00


Scott,

Sounds like you may have gone to Davis. We covered this in Plant Science
2. Go Ags?

Only one quibble with your post: soils in Oregon will differ greatly
between the acidic soils of the rain-soaked western Cascades and the very
alkaline desert east. Saying soils in Oregon are acidic is only part of
the story.


Quote:
> Fellow rosarians:

> OK, this is the first of a series on this that I will post on
> fertilizing roses. Since there are/were many posts asking about
> rose fertilizer to use, and if MiricleGro works, etc. I will post
> this explanation which will be rather detailed. Opinions vary, as
> will your rose blooms...

>            Rose Fertilizers Defined, part I

> It seems that the stores have lots of types of fertilizers on the
> shelves, and they vary greatly in price. So which one do you buy?
> Do you buy the Special Rose formula, or the Super Duper Rose
> formula? Should you get the green slow release pellets in the box?
> Or the blue soluble stuff in the bags? Should you buy the Miricle
> Gro[TM] formula or the off brand next to it for less? Should you go
> organic or chemical? Or combine both?

> OK, first things first. Every bag or bottle of fertilizer
> has to have the % breakdown of nitrogen, phosphate and potassium
> on the label, and it is always in that order. Regardless of what
> the package says it is for, the formula must be on it. The %
> breakdown is labeled in a series of numbers, such as 30-10-10, or
> 10-15-10. 30-10-10 means that it has 30% NITROGEN, 10% PHOSPHOROUS,
> and 10% POTASSIUM by volume. This is a high nitrogen fertilizer,
> and is the composition of MirAcid[TM] (a Miricle Gro fertilizer that
> is popular). 10-15-10 means that it has 10% nitrogen, 15% potassium,
> and 10% phosphate. This is the formula for MiricleGro[TM] fertilizer.
> Other trace elements such as manganese, chelated iron, sulfur, etc.
> are also listed in fine print. These trace elements are also important,
> but not as much as nitrogen, phosphate and potassium.

> There are all sorts of %-%-% combinations, and I have seen just
> about avery combination imaginable claim that it is specially
> formulated for roses. I have also seen the same formulas in bottles at
> places like Long's *** with the exact same %-%-% labeled for different
> plants and priced accordingly! The "general" house plant food was in a
> green bottle for $2.29. The same formula in a yellow bottle was labeled
> for "flowering plants" for $2.59. And the violet bottle was labeled
> for "African Violets & Orchids" and listed for $2.89!!! And they all had
> the exact same %-%-% formula! A similar thing happens with brand
> marketing, but I will get into that in a future post. The point is that
> the numbers on the packages tell you what the fertilizer is, and not the
> brand name or what the lable says it is for.

> So you might be wondering what to feed your roses then? It really
> depends on soil type (acidic or alkaline) and what climate you live
> in. Soil Ph creates a problem chemically in soils and what is true
> for acidic soil is quite different in alkaline soil. Here's why:
> In acidic soils, phosphorous is not as available to plant roots,
> and gets locked up in the soil. something like 1% of the phosphorous
> in the soil is available to plant roots. So in acid soil regions, you
> need to add more phosphorous than you do in alkaline soil regions.
> Here in California, the soil is mostly alkaline, and thus phosphorous
> is not needed as much. Likewise, in Oregon where the soil is acidic,
> phosphorous is needed more. A similar, but opposite problem exists for
> iron. In alkaline soils, iron is not available to plants, and thus the
> need to add chelated iron here. In acidic soil iron is available, and
> thus not really a problem (nor as much needed in feeding).

> As for feeding your roses, in San Diego, CA they will require a lot
> more nitrogen and heavy feeding than they will in say, Vancouver, BC,
> Canada where they will have a shorter growing/blooming period. roses
> tend to be heavy feeders, and as someone said in another post to this
> newsgroup, they are more like pigs. They will eat anything. This is
> quite true, as UC Davis studies show that fertilizers of all types
> and origins will be taken up by the plant and used in the same way.
> Regradless of how much you paid for it at the store.

> So lets review:

> All fertilizers have the 3 main components listed on them in the order
> of: nitrogen, phosphorous and potassium in % breakdown. Trace elements
> are also listed. The elements needed vary depending on the soil type
> and Ph that you grow your roses in. Phosphate is needed more in acidic
> soils, and (chelated) iron is needed more in alkaline soils. And finally
> roses are gluttons, think of them as ravenous pigs.  

> More *fertilizer* to come...

> Scott
> Campbell, CA

Patrick Burke
Project Services Coordinator
Biological Sciences Division Information Services
The University of Chicago

 
 
 

Fertilizers defined, part I

Post by Scott Dickins » Wed, 11 Feb 1998 04:00:00



Quote:

> >...think of them as ravenous pigs...  

> >More *fertilizer* to come...

> you just felt the need, huh?
> very well, Scott.  Did you get hit on the head by one of those pineapples?

> m

Well, if you prefer I not post, just say the word... I certainly can
do other things with my time.

More pineapples arriving today, yes.

Scott
Campbell, CA

 
 
 

Fertilizers defined, part I

Post by william S. Hillm » Wed, 11 Feb 1998 04:00:00



Quote:
> Fellow rosarians:

> OK, this is the first of a series on this that I will post on
> fertilizing roses. Since there are/were many posts asking about
> rose fertilizer to use, and if MiricleGro works, etc. I will post
> this explanation which will be rather detailed. Opinions vary, as
> will your rose blooms...

>            Rose Fertilizers Defined, part I

> It seems that the stores have lots of types of fertilizers on the
> shelves, and they vary greatly in price. So which one do you buy?
> Do you buy the Special Rose formula, or the Super Duper Rose
> formula? Should you get the green slow release pellets in the box?
> Or the blue soluble stuff in the bags? Should you buy the Miricle
> Gro[TM] formula or the off brand next to it for less? Should you go
> organic or chemical? Or combine both?

> OK, first things first. Every bag or bottle of fertilizer
> has to have the % breakdown of nitrogen, phosphate and potassium
> on the label, and it is always in that order. Regardless of what
> the package says it is for, the formula must be on it. The %
> breakdown is labeled in a series of numbers, such as 30-10-10, or
> 10-15-10. 30-10-10 means that it has 30% NITROGEN, 10% PHOSPHOROUS,
> and 10% POTASSIUM by volume. This is a high nitrogen fertilizer,
> and is the composition of MirAcid[TM] (a Miricle Gro fertilizer that
> is popular). 10-15-10 means that it has 10% nitrogen, 15% potassium,
> and 10% phosphate. This is the formula for MiricleGro[TM] fertilizer.
> Other trace elements such as manganese, chelated iron, sulfur, etc.
> are also listed in fine print. These trace elements are also important,
> but not as much as nitrogen, phosphate and potassium.

> There are all sorts of %-%-% combinations, and I have seen just
> about avery combination imaginable claim that it is specially
> formulated for roses. I have also seen the same formulas in bottles at
> places like Long's *** with the exact same %-%-% labeled for different
> plants and priced accordingly! The "general" house plant food was in a
> green bottle for $2.29. The same formula in a yellow bottle was labeled
> for "flowering plants" for $2.59. And the violet bottle was labeled
> for "African Violets & Orchids" and listed for $2.89!!! And they all had
> the exact same %-%-% formula! A similar thing happens with brand
> marketing, but I will get into that in a future post. The point is that
> the numbers on the packages tell you what the fertilizer is, and not the
> brand name or what the lable says it is for.

> So you might be wondering what to feed your roses then? It really
> depends on soil type (acidic or alkaline) and what climate you live
> in. Soil Ph creates a problem chemically in soils and what is true
> for acidic soil is quite different in alkaline soil. Here's why:
> In acidic soils, phosphorous is not as available to plant roots,
> and gets locked up in the soil. something like 1% of the phosphorous
> in the soil is available to plant roots. So in acid soil regions, you
> need to add more phosphorous than you do in alkaline soil regions.
> Here in California, the soil is mostly alkaline, and thus phosphorous
> is not needed as much. Likewise, in Oregon where the soil is acidic,
> phosphorous is needed more. A similar, but opposite problem exists for
> iron. In alkaline soils, iron is not available to plants, and thus the
> need to add chelated iron here. In acidic soil iron is available, and
> thus not really a problem (nor as much needed in feeding).

> As for feeding your roses, in San Diego, CA they will require a lot
> more nitrogen and heavy feeding than they will in say, Vancouver, BC,
> Canada where they will have a shorter growing/blooming period. roses
> tend to be heavy feeders, and as someone said in another post to this
> newsgroup, they are more like pigs. They will eat anything. This is
> quite true, as UC Davis studies show that fertilizers of all types
> and origins will be taken up by the plant and used in the same way.
> Regradless of how much you paid for it at the store.

> So lets review:

> All fertilizers have the 3 main components listed on them in the order
> of: nitrogen, phosphorous and potassium in % breakdown. Trace elements
> are also listed. The elements needed vary depending on the soil type
> and Ph that you grow your roses in. Phosphate is needed more in acidic
> soils, and (chelated) iron is needed more in alkaline soils. And finally
> roses are gluttons, think of them as ravenous pigs.  

> More *fertilizer* to come...

> Scott
> Campbell, CA

Bottom line is get the one on sale and save money.  The special formulas (big
gyps) are not worth the money.  Get one ones on simple bags if possible in
large sizes.  Roses will not know the difference and soils vary even in the
same location and the only true way to know what to buy is have a soil test
using a mixture of soil from your yard as even in the same Garden the soil
can vary. For PH the electronic meters do a good and quick job.  Easy to
calibrate as most cities either give a yearly analysis or you can call and
get the ph. The meter then should indicate very close to their figures.    
Just because somebody lives in California does not mean they will have a
alkaline soil and a high ph.  Where I lived in L.A. it was the case. Ph was
over 7.8 way too high for roses and it was a constant battle to lower it to
even near neutral 7.0.  I moved to Alhambra 19 miles away but on a different
water supply but treated the beds the same as L.A. and found the ph had
dropped to 5.5 causing very sick roses.  (Camellias were sure happy).  Upon
testing untreated soil found the reading to be 7.1 or a very good soil for
roses.  We try to keep it at 6.8.  With the rains we just got it may even be
lower now.  Test before treating  any soil for PH.

Bill

 
 
 

Fertilizers defined, part I

Post by amjorda » Thu, 12 Feb 1998 04:00:00


Thanks for the info!  We newbies appreciate it.  Pray, carry on!
--A.M.



Quote:
> Fellow rosarians:

> OK, this is the first of a series on this that I will post on
> fertilizing roses. Since there are/were many posts asking about
> rose fertilizer to use, and if MiricleGro works, etc. I will post
> this explanation which will be rather detailed. Opinions vary, as
> will your rose blooms...

>            Rose Fertilizers Defined, part I

> It seems that the stores have lots of types of fertilizers on the
> shelves, and they vary greatly in price. So which one do you buy?
> Do you buy the Special Rose formula, or the Super Duper Rose
> formula? Should you get the green slow release pellets in the box?
> Or the blue soluble stuff in the bags? Should you buy the Miricle
> Gro[TM] formula or the off brand next to it for less? Should you go
> organic or chemical? Or combine both?

> OK, first things first. Every bag or bottle of fertilizer
> has to have the % breakdown of nitrogen, phosphate and potassium
> on the label, and it is always in that order. Regardless of what
> the package says it is for, the formula must be on it. The %
> breakdown is labeled in a series of numbers, such as 30-10-10, or
> 10-15-10. 30-10-10 means that it has 30% NITROGEN, 10% PHOSPHOROUS,
> and 10% POTASSIUM by volume. This is a high nitrogen fertilizer,
> and is the composition of MirAcid[TM] (a Miricle Gro fertilizer that
> is popular). 10-15-10 means that it has 10% nitrogen, 15% potassium,
> and 10% phosphate. This is the formula for MiricleGro[TM] fertilizer.
> Other trace elements such as manganese, chelated iron, sulfur, etc.
> are also listed in fine print. These trace elements are also important,
> but not as much as nitrogen, phosphate and potassium.

> There are all sorts of %-%-% combinations, and I have seen just
> about avery combination imaginable claim that it is specially
> formulated for roses. I have also seen the same formulas in bottles at
> places like Long's *** with the exact same %-%-% labeled for different
> plants and priced accordingly! The "general" house plant food was in a
> green bottle for $2.29. The same formula in a yellow bottle was labeled
> for "flowering plants" for $2.59. And the violet bottle was labeled
> for "African Violets & Orchids" and listed for $2.89!!! And they all had
> the exact same %-%-% formula! A similar thing happens with brand
> marketing, but I will get into that in a future post. The point is that
> the numbers on the packages tell you what the fertilizer is, and not the
> brand name or what the lable says it is for.

> So you might be wondering what to feed your roses then? It really
> depends on soil type (acidic or alkaline) and what climate you live
> in. Soil Ph creates a problem chemically in soils and what is true
> for acidic soil is quite different in alkaline soil. Here's why:
> In acidic soils, phosphorous is not as available to plant roots,
> and gets locked up in the soil. something like 1% of the phosphorous
> in the soil is available to plant roots. So in acid soil regions, you
> need to add more phosphorous than you do in alkaline soil regions.
> Here in California, the soil is mostly alkaline, and thus phosphorous
> is not needed as much. Likewise, in Oregon where the soil is acidic,
> phosphorous is needed more. A similar, but opposite problem exists for
> iron. In alkaline soils, iron is not available to plants, and thus the
> need to add chelated iron here. In acidic soil iron is available, and
> thus not really a problem (nor as much needed in feeding).

> As for feeding your roses, in San Diego, CA they will require a lot
> more nitrogen and heavy feeding than they will in say, Vancouver, BC,
> Canada where they will have a shorter growing/blooming period. roses
> tend to be heavy feeders, and as someone said in another post to this
> newsgroup, they are more like pigs. They will eat anything. This is
> quite true, as UC Davis studies show that fertilizers of all types
> and origins will be taken up by the plant and used in the same way.
> Regradless of how much you paid for it at the store.

> So lets review:

> All fertilizers have the 3 main components listed on them in the order
> of: nitrogen, phosphorous and potassium in % breakdown. Trace elements
> are also listed. The elements needed vary depending on the soil type
> and Ph that you grow your roses in. Phosphate is needed more in acidic
> soils, and (chelated) iron is needed more in alkaline soils. And finally
> roses are gluttons, think of them as ravenous pigs.  

> More *fertilizer* to come...

> Scott
> Campbell, CA

 
 
 

Fertilizers defined, part I

Post by lm » Thu, 12 Feb 1998 04:00:00



Quote:



>> >...think of them as ravenous pigs...  

>> >More *fertilizer* to come...

>> you just felt the need, huh?
>> very well, Scott.  Did you get hit on the head by one of those pineapples?

>> m

>Well, if you prefer I not post, just say the word... I certainly can
>do other things with my time.

>More pineapples arriving today, yes.

yo prefiero Taco Bell pero Domino's Delivers.
yeah, we had pineapples yesterday, absolutely the meanest looking sky
I've ever seen, blackblack (actually just dark red) with just the longest
darkest grey fingers and the wind and the swirls with rain and hail and then
snow, sun too.  As soon as the hail stopped I planted Henri and Yolande, a
couple of roses I hope live for generations.

No, Scott, really, I'd let people have part II.  Scott got into it, seemed
inspired and motivated.  That was my observation.  
If you prefer, let me say, I ap*pre*sheeated you post.  But I'm going with
horseshiut this year.  Real food for real people.  And I guess I'll supplement
that with the cheapest fertilizer on sale.

m

 
 
 

Fertilizers defined, part I

Post by Scott Dickins » Thu, 12 Feb 1998 04:00:00


A few corrections/updates to my post yesterday:

I said that Oregon soil is generally acidic. This is true in
Portland/Willamette Valley and coastal region of Oregon
which is the most populated. However in Eastern Oregon it
will tend to be more varied. In California, alkaline soil
is generally prevalent due to the Mediterranean climate;
wet winters and dry summers tend to create alkaline soils.
Also the water here is commonly very alkaline as it comes
to the cities and the Central Valley in long irrigation canals
and the evaporation causes the alkaline salts to increase
considerably. However, these are generalizations that I use
for examples only, and there are variations within these
states. But the overall tendency of soil Ph in the populated
areas of CA and OR are as stated.

Also note that the Ph scale is log scale; and changing soil
Ph is not that easy. You can use products like RAK that will
change the Ph, but I never have had a problem growing roses
due to soil PH. A *very* cheap way to tell the soil type
that you have (save on the tester) is to plant Hydrangias.
They will bloom blue in acid soil, and pink in alkaline soil.
They are just like litmus paper... an acid test, as it were.
Or drive around and look at the hydrangias in bloom in your
neighborhood that are planted in the ground. They will tell
you what soil type you have! Yes, this is how nurseries get
hydrangias to bloom in blue and pink. It is not a different
variety of hydrangia, the blooms are responding to soil Ph ;)

Scott
Campbell, CA  

 
 
 

Fertilizers defined, part I

Post by william S. Hillm » Thu, 12 Feb 1998 04:00:00



Quote:
> A few corrections/updates to my post yesterday:

> I said that Oregon soil is generally acidic. This is true in
> Portland/Willamette Valley and coastal region of Oregon
> which is the most populated. However in Eastern Oregon it
> will tend to be more varied. In California, alkaline soil
> is generally prevalent due to the Mediterranean climate;
> wet winters and dry summers tend to create alkaline soils.
> Also the water here is commonly very alkaline as it comes
> to the cities and the Central Valley in long irrigation canals
> and the evaporation causes the alkaline salts to increase
> considerably. However, these are generalizations that I use
> for examples only, and there are variations within these
> states. But the overall tendency of soil Ph in the populated
> areas of CA and OR are as stated.

> Also note that the Ph scale is log scale; and changing soil
> Ph is not that easy. You can use products like RAK that will
> change the Ph, but I never have had a problem growing roses
> due to soil PH. A *very* cheap way to tell the soil type
> that you have (save on the tester) is to plant Hydrangias.
> They will bloom blue in acid soil, and pink in alkaline soil.
> They are just like litmus paper... an acid test, as it were.
> Or drive around and look at the hydrangias in bloom in your
> neighborhood that are planted in the ground. They will tell
> you what soil type you have! Yes, this is how nurseries get
> hydrangias to bloom in blue and pink. It is not a different
> variety of hydrangia, the blooms are responding to soil Ph ;)

> Scott
> Campbell, CA  

It isn't the central valley water that is the problem but the Colorado river
water which is far worse.  Guess you never tried to grow roses using it.  
Central valley waster is darn good in comparison.  The best water well which
we have in most of the San Gabriel Valley.  But 25% of our city is on Metro
water which is Colorado river junk.  

Bill in Alhambra Calif.

1:42:14 am  2/11/1998

 
 
 

Fertilizers defined, part I

Post by Pat Walke » Thu, 12 Feb 1998 04:00:00


snip

Quote:

> It isn't the central valley water that is the problem but the Colorado river
> water which is far worse.  Guess you never tried to grow roses using it.
> Central valley waster is darn good in comparison.  The best water well which
> we have in most of the San Gabriel Valley.  But 25% of our city is on Metro
> water which is Colorado river junk.

> Bill in Alhambra Calif.

> 1:42:14 am  2/11/1998

Hey Bill,  I know Metro gets not only Colorado River stuff, but also
eastern Sierra and Central Valley water (one of the major purveyors of
SWP, too).  So is the water source/delivery different to the different
individual water companies in the LA area?  And I thought the San
Gabriel valley groundwater was highly polluted with industrial waste,
such that they were going to have to do expensive remediation?  I used
to sit on a small regional water distric board, and got into the water
usage in Ca. pretty heavily.  I'm still interested in the water
situation, and am curious about Metro.  As one of the biggest water
players in California, they shape the debate on water usage policy.

And for those not in the Metro area, you can either check your water Ph,
out of the faucet, or look at your annual statement from your water
purveyer for the Ph, as well as lists of tested contaminates. (required
report by feds).  My old water district had water in the 8 Ph range, and
consequently, adding it to sandy soil meant a Ph of 9 (unaltered).  Not
liked by many roses.  Added Sulfer alot after finding that out.

--
__________________________________________
Pat Walker

I am generally to be found in my garden, whose soil Ph is still a
mystery to me as I have yet to test it.  (soon!).


__________________________________________

 
 
 

Fertilizers defined, part I

Post by Margo Th » Thu, 12 Feb 1998 04:00:00



Quote:



>> >...think of them as ravenous pigs...  

>> >More *fertilizer* to come...

>> you just felt the need, huh?
>> very well, Scott.  Did you get hit on the head by one of those pineapples?

>> m

>Well, if you prefer I not post, just say the word... I certainly can
>do other things with my time.

>More pineapples arriving today, yes.

>Scott

Keep the fertilizer notes coming.  I know a fair amount about this topic, but at
this time of year I always appreciate a refresher.  I usually glean something
new or something forgotten.

And just to let you California folks know -- you are not alone!  The Pineapple
Express crashed through the West Coast of Canada yesterday dumping major amounts
of rain.  But then this is pretty normal, so the heavy rain hasn't wreaked the
environmental havoc it has in California.

Margo

 
 
 

Fertilizers defined, part I

Post by Scott Dickins » Fri, 13 Feb 1998 04:00:00


Quote:
> Bill in Alhambra Calif. writes:
> It isn't the central valley water that is the problem but the Colorado river
> water which is far worse.  Guess you never tried to grow roses using it.  

Quite the contrary, I *have*... I lived in San Diego for many moons and
had the largest rose garden there that I have ever had. They won awards...
My orchids won awards there as well... San Diego water has a high percentage
of Colorado River, via LA, water. It tastes terrible, and is very hard. The
river water is not the problem though. I have been to the Colorado River,
and the water there tastes GREAT! The problem is that it gains alkalinity
on the long path in the irrigation canals through the C. Valley and to So.
Cal. from there. Soil alkalinity build-up in Central Valley soil is a major
problem... written up many times in the CA Ag magazines.  

Quote:
> Central valley waster is darn good in comparison.  The best water well which
> we have in most of the San Gabriel Valley.  But 25% of our city is on Metro
> water which is Colorado river junk.  

Do realize that withouth that "junk", California would for the most part not
exist. Without it they would have pumped the Central Valley wells dry a long
time ago... But the gas additives that are leeching into the water table
are a far bigger problem than Ph. And more "junk" in the Colorado River is
going to go to AZ and NV in the near future and California is going to have
a serious water shortage when this El Nino is over.

But we have strayed somewhat from the topic of roses here...  

Regards,

Scott
Campbell, CA